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Mar 7 16 3:41 AM

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For the last few days I have felt a marked increase in sexual desire for men, specifically, very vivid sexual fantasies that hit me at any random time during the day. The common element among them is something that I can only describe as the feeling of being taken. They are overwhelming, and leave me with the longing for "the real thing". This may have to do with my subconscious finally receiving a "green light", with the dressing up, the talking and the conscious attempt at looking more feminine on the outside - supported by my girlfriend with a willingness that sometime surpasses my own - or it could be withdrawal symptoms from a severe (?) pornography addiction. Either way, even for someone who - to a degree - enjoys having a dirty mind, it gets disconcerting, maybe even more so because I am trying to find a balance, not to throw myself off.
Anyone can relate?
 
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#1 [url]

Mar 7 16 12:38 PM

My understanding of it is that dysphoria can manifest in a variety of different ways.  But if you are looking for a medical diagnosis the best resource is probably the DSM.

http://www.dsm5.org/documents/gender%20dysphoria%20fact%20sheet.pdf


Characteristics of the Condition 

For a person to be diagnosed with gender dysphoria, there must be a marked difference between the individual’s expressed/experienced gender and the gender others would assign him or her, and it must continue for at least six months. In children, the desire to be of the other gender must be present and verbalized. This condition causes clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning. 

Gender dysphoria is manifested in a variety of ways, including strong desires to be treated as the other gender or to be rid of one’s sex characteristics, or a strong conviction that one has feelings and reactions typical of the other gender. 

The DSM-5 diagnosis adds a post-transition specifier for people who are living full-time as the desired gender (with or without legal sanction of the gender change). This ensures treatment access for individuals who continue to undergo hormone therapy, related surgery, or psychotherapy or counseling to support their gender transition.


Jack posted one from the DSM on the older version of this forum (and I think he has some scanned pages of the entire section of the DSM either in the Library or on the Crossdreamers.com site):

http://www.crossdreamlife.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2692&sid=18d542ec8c0c6752ee8cae6d23e39516


Gender Dysphoria in Adolescents and Adults 302.95 (F64.1)

A. A marked incongruence between one's experience/expressed gender and assigned gender, of at least 6 months' duration, as manifested by at least two of the following: 

1. A marked incongruence between one's experienced/expressed gender and primary and/or secondary sex characteristics (or in young adolescents, the anticipated sex characteristics). 

2. A strong desire to be rid of one's primary and /or secondary sex characteristics because of a marked incongruence with one's experienced/expressed gender (or in young adolescents, a desire to prevent the development of the anticipated secondary sex characteristics) 

3. A strong desire for the primary and/or secondary sex characteristics of the other gender. 

4. A strong desire to be of the other gender (or some alternative gender different from one's assigned gender). 

5. A strong desire to be treated as the other gender (or some alternative gender different from one's assigned gender). 

6. A strong conviction that one has the typical feelings and reactions of the other gender (or some alternative gender different from one's assigned gender). 

[p. 453] B. The condition is associated with clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning.
Personally, I have never been professionally diagnosed by I do believe I am dysphoric because I strongly match 3 and 4, and to a lesser extent 2 and 5 and have since I was 12.  For me, and what I believe to be dysphoria (IANAD) is expressed as a strong desire to be female physically and a lesser desire to be seen by others that way and treated accordingly.  

This desire is perfectly synched with my crossdreaming comes to me in waves of highs and lows.  As it increases I feel an sense of euphoria by thinking of myself as a female but eventually this feeling starts to turn obsessive and all I can think is "I wish I was a girl."  Eventually due to my reality not matching my fantasies I start to get depressed.  At it worst it feels like I am being eaten up from the inside out and I have the sensation of a ball in my chest that just keeps getting bigger and bigger till I think it is about to explode.

If it reaches that stage it will usually be followed by a giant lull in crossdreaming/fantasies.  During this time I feel completely disconnected from myself and hollow, more like a robot going through the motions than a person.  

Fortunately, I spend most of my time somewhere between these two extremes...though i would be lying if I didn't admit to enjoying the short periods of euphoric crossdreaming.

Last Edited By: Lost247365 Mar 7 16 12:55 PM. Edited 2 times.

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#2 [url]

Mar 7 16 4:08 PM

Francesca, I'm certainly no expert on dysphoria, so I can just give an opinion. What you described does not seem like dysphoria as I understand it. It seems like sexual desire (and there is nothing wrong with that!)

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#3 [url]

Mar 8 16 1:51 AM

Francesca, my opinon about that. I can not judje have you gender disphoria or not generaly, but that your feelings very relate for me (and i don't think that it is part of gender disphoria), because i also have some-times very strong sexual desire toward man. And it is controversial and some "dirty" feelengs for me, because i married and don't want betray my wife.
But i see in your case two moments. First, normal sexual desire of man. You have not this expirience right now and it is existing lack. Probably pro-active top role of your girl-friend in sex can help you. Another moment - its your fear of rapid change in your life. Your internal desires (repressed so a lot of time) now became true so rapidly, but probably some your internal fear and phobia try to stop you. Just relax, and do with your girl-friend what makes you and her happy.
And remember, you not alone in your feelengs, and nothing shameful and bad in what you feel.

p.s. In other post Jack already wrote about fresh research of "pornography addiction" and probably that kind of addiction just not exist.

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#4 [url]

Mar 8 16 4:15 AM

Lost247365 wrote:
Personally, I have never been professionally diagnosed by I do believe I am dysphoric because I strongly match 3 and 4, and to a lesser extent 2 and 5. [...]This desire is perfectly synched with my crossdreaming comes to me in waves of highs and lows.  As it increases I feel an sense of euphoria by thinking of myself as a female but eventually this feeling starts to turn obsessive and all I can think is "I wish I was a girl." 

Thank you for sharing that. It sounds very familiar, although, for it to get to a degree high enough for me to understand what it meant, it took many years, and I'm still somewhat unsure. The waves of highs and lows too, very familiar. During the "highs", when single, I'd seek no-strings-attached male partners online, then during the lows I'd go back to "hetero mode". During the highs, with a partner, I'd simultaneously think it was normal in the situation to feel like a woman (I'd shave and I wanted to act feminine) but, at the same time, I would have to keep the degree of womanhood in check, to hide it at least partially from partners that would sometimes explicitly tell me that they didn't like it. A huge, huge blind spot. Maybe this is why for me I think it would be as important to be seen and treated like a woman as much as to look like one. 

 
Francesca, I'm certainly no expert on dysphoria, so I can just give an opinion. What you described does not seem like dysphoria as I understand it. It seems like sexual desire (and there is nothing wrong with that!)

I agree, maybe it isn't dysphoria in itself, but it's certainly a demonstration of a female-like lust :) Nothing wrong with it in itself, I love it, it just comes as a huge distraction in a moment when I am trying to have a rational conversation to figure out who I really am and where I am going to go. I am comfortable experimenting with just about any aspect of my gender, but only as far as shame does not take over and manage to slow me down or stop me, at least for now. not to mention the rest of my life (girlfriend, work...). On the contrary, these fantasies come from a place in my spirit where I have already been a girl for a very long time, a 100% girl, who loves make up and turning on guys and getting ravaged, and doesn't care much about anything else. Her power scares me.
First, normal sexual desire of man. You have not this expirience right now and it is existing lack. Probably pro-active top role of your girl-friend in sex can help you. 

I don't know, Eva, my girlfriend is definitely not the masculine type. I am really blessed in having such an amazing partner, but expecting from anyone who is not naturally inclined in that way to be as good a male partner in bed as she is a female would be too much. :) But you may be right, and we are working on it :)
p.s. In other post Jack already wrote about fresh research of "pornography addiction" and probably that kind of addiction just not exist.

Really curious about reading it :) I recently saw a few studies making the point that in general the idea of any "chemistry" (brain or otherwise) being addictive in and of itself is wrong, and that until there are distressing life circumstances, people can make regular use of any drug (from alcohol to heroin) without it causing a dependency, or causing any disfunction. Which resonates a lot with my experience, as I have been an "occasional" almost anything (drinker, smoker, drug user) for my entire life, and never ran into troubles, no bingeing, no attachments. But these studies I read make the point that if you are in stressful life circumstances then you could develop addiction, and I have to admit that I have used pornography, in the last year at least, as a conscious refuge from a period of extremely dull professional life, from which I currently have no escape. And, unlike cigarettes, which I could smoke right now and forget about for as long as I like, I have to admit that, in absence of pornography, when I am bored at work, I feel "a void to fill". It may very well be that I feel this emptiness because pornography has been a gateway to my discovery of being trans, after all I didn't feel dependent on pornography until I started with the "sissy stuff". But it's also true that, even though I felt it didn't cause any trouble, pornography has always been my favorite indulgence as an adult. So I have to be very careful on this one. 

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#5 [url]

Mar 14 16 6:05 PM

Francesca
yes, i really think, that you must try some-thing new with your girl-friend, like she will be dominant top, in traditioonal man role. Of course i clear understand that woman can not replace man in all fields (emotinal level, touch to man body and a lot of other, i think you understand) but at least it will be fresh and new expirience.

About dependency and addiction.
My main viewpoint that chemistry primary basis for that (basic for all, for our social behavoir, romantic choice, and a lot of other). But really addiction system, which work across dopamine and orexine, it is not so bad, that system supports positive for body behavior. For example, you it first time some tasty meat, your chemistry make mark like "it teasty" "eat it again" make you some-kind of addiction for tasty meat:)) it is good option. But in the case of drugs that system coud work wrong, and make addiction for worst stimulus. But you say, that for your pesonal expirience, you use a lot of substances and don't expirience addiction. It is probably true and not against chemical theory of addiction. Because exist a lot of factors of prevention of addiction. First of all high level of social activity and life rich for events and other pleasures. If you will be live alone without a lot of events and other reasons for pleasure, yes in that case risk of addiction extrimly high

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#6 [url]

Mar 15 16 7:14 PM

Have you considered that you may be sexually submissive? I feel the same way -- I want to be dominated and controlled by my partner during sex. For me, it happens whether I'm in boy mode or girl mode. Crossdreaming can overlap with D/s.

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#7 [url]

Mar 16 16 2:43 AM

Hi Sofie, well, I know I am submissive. I recognized this only in the last couple of years - despite not having had sex with guys for a lot longer than that - . Around girls, at least until recently, I was normally dominant. Since I have realized I'm transgender, I have become much more submissive also around girls. I am also making other changes to look and feel more feminine, but these are conscious choices rather. It all may or may not be temporary.

My relationship with my girlfriend - as we were discussing with Eva - is attempting to integrate this new aspect, with varied degrees of success. But the reality is that submissiveness is only a part of it. There is an almost desperate desire of being an object of lust. Being penetrated is an obsession, and it has strong roots in my past experiences with guys, some of which left unforgettable marks. Plus, I love male bodies, and I love the idea of giving pleasure to men, for which being submissive is not even necessary.

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#8 [url]

Mar 17 16 12:40 AM

Francesca said
"There is an almost desperate desire of being an object of lust. Being penetrated is an obsession, and it has strong roots in my past experiences with guys, some of which left unforgettable marks. Plus, I love male bodies, and I love the idea of giving pleasure to men, for which being submissive is not even necessary''

Very simillar feelings. For me submissive/dominant role is fluid and for sexual desire toward woman and toward man. And yes, i can understand that, giving pleasure to man in different ways. It is strong desire..
.And other aspect, i don't know , probably it is related to you too?
I a lot od use crossdressing (some-times i already think that it just not "cross" but normal my female dressing) but sexy crossdressing for me painful point. What i mean, if i use lingery, make up and sexy dress, and make it good....i feel sadness...because what meaning be sexy in loneliness near the mirror? It is useless. I want to man had see me, want me, feel desire toward me. I want be sexy not only for myself, but for man.

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#9 [url]

Mar 17 16 4:05 AM

Eva, I feel many of the same ways you do about dressing in sexy lingerie. If I enjoy it and want to be alluring what good is it to be that way by myself? It's exciting but also brings up hurt and sadness. I have shopped in lingerie stores for such things but usually don't buy anything because I don't have anyone to share them with.

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#10 [url]

Mar 17 16 6:12 PM

Oh, Emma, some-times i thinked that it is specific for me, but now i see that you have same feelings, and probably a lot of us too. Need more often share my feelengs:)
But i think for us it is element of female sexuality. We are females, we want to be beauty for other, sexy for other, and excite others.

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#11 [url]

Mar 17 16 11:41 PM

I currently feel the same sort of frustration about crossdressing, but for a different reason. Since I haven't decided that I am not going to live at least partially as a woman (who is going to stop me, aside from my own sense of shame?) and I know it won't take me much more than a wig and decent makeup skills to muster the courage to go out and pass at the most basic level, I am impatient to complete my look. I might at least join a local transgender chapter, make friends, and put my nose out "en femme" every now and then.

I see the female self within about to shine on the surface - but in bits and pieces. The process is error prone and expensive, and therefore slow, especially when it comes to things like picking the right makeup colors, losing just enough weight, stopping/reversing hair loss, and keep my naturally inordinate amount of body hair to a minimum without damaging my skin. This last one is a real nightmare, beginning with a thick black beard! It never really goes away, not even after a close shave. I could get it zapped, but I love to grow it as a man because I look good in it, and I find the idea of parting forever from it difficult to accept, at least at this time.

On the opposite, the second the girl living in my head sees herself baby smooth and wrapped in a sexy dress, she wants go out and make truck drivers grunt. Of course she does. Now: maybe she will at some point, maybe she won't. But if I muster enough momentum, I think I'll give her the chance to at least go out and show off a bit. As a 35 years old, without children or particular responsibilities, I am young enough and mature enough to get the most enjoyment out of it. Of course I'd happily rewind the clock ten years, but alas. I see nothing wrong with walking down the street and being yelled "tranny!" at by a passing car, if needs be. I'm nobody. I have no reputation to defend :) Also, maybe life is not worth living in a constant state of sexual and identity frustration. We are in a historical moment of relative freedom, and at the pinnacle of our technological and economical possibilities. We are uniquely seated, in the entire human history, to take our chances. So maybe we should :)

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#12 [url]

Mar 18 16 10:25 AM

Francesca said "I might at least join a local transgender chapter, make friends, and put my nose out "en femme" every now and then." and "As a 35 years old, without children or particular responsibilities, I am young enough and mature enough to get the most enjoyment out of it"

Francesca,  Oh I hope you do!  I first joined a TG club when I was 48, and wish I had at 35.  It was a great experience.  For me it was an opportunity to go out as Cindy to a safe and welcoming place and make some like-minded friends, and have a great time too.  We had monthly meetings, events, dances, cookouts, etc.  I highly recommend it.

I first started going out as Cindy in my 30's.  At first it was a very scary and stressful experience.  But very satisfying, once I found the courage.  In those days, I usually didn't even have any place really to go to….. just being out was real progress.

Another thing you might enjoy is going to a transformation studio.  These are places that specialize in makeup and dressing and help us look our feminine best.  Many of them have all sorts of package deals that include outings, shopping, photographs and such.  I have been to many of these all across the USA.  I had some wonderful experiences at some of these.

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#13 [url]

Mar 18 16 3:40 PM

Francesca wrote:
Hi Sofie, well, I know I am submissive. I recognized this only in the last couple of years - despite not having had sex with guys for a lot longer than that - . Around girls, at least until recently, I was normally dominant. Since I have realized I'm transgender, I have become much more submissive also around girls. I am also making other changes to look and feel more feminine, but these are conscious choices rather. It all may or may not be temporary.

My relationship with my girlfriend - as we were discussing with Eva - is attempting to integrate this new aspect, with varied degrees of success. But the reality is that submissiveness is only a part of it. There is an almost desperate desire of being an object of lust. Being penetrated is an obsession, and it has strong roots in my past experiences with guys, some of which left unforgettable marks. Plus, I love male bodies, and I love the idea of giving pleasure to men, for which being submissive is not even necessary.

Have you tried pegging? I don't know if your girlfriend is into it, but it might be worth a shot.

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#14 [url]

Mar 18 16 3:43 PM

Emmasweet wrote:
Eva, I feel many of the same ways you do about dressing in sexy lingerie. If I enjoy it and want to be alluring what good is it to be that way by myself? It's exciting but also brings up hurt and sadness. I have shopped in lingerie stores for such things but usually don't buy anything because I don't have anyone to share them with.

Yes, me too. I like to paint my nails because I find it to be very relaxing and soothing. But to get fully dressed -- I want to be seen as a girl, so it feels pointless to do it by myself.

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#15 [url]

Mar 18 16 5:08 PM

Hi Francesca :)

I cannot relate. it could possibly be that keeping my "sexuality" and my "gender" identity separated is the only way I have found any clarity. Also, my BFF/Wife/Doc helps because our ideas about sexuality are the same. It's just biology. VERY powerful biology. If it's strong enough to rearrange your skeletal structure, that's some powerful stuff! I get the idea about just wanting to "surrender" to someone. The question is, are there other aspects of life that you feel the same way about right now? The greatest gratification I get from leaving the house dressed is having nobody even notice me. But at home, I pretty much dress all the time. Even when people come over, like my kids. I know everything I am wearing is women's wear, that's all that is important. I'm still wearing perfume. About four rings and usually a bracelet and ALWAYS a necklace. For me, the idea seems not to look "attractive" or even "provocative". I just want to look seamless and presentable and not "normal" but "neutral" if that makes sense, not overly sexual but not drab either.

You might want to do this test. maybe help you with your questions. http://transsexual.org/cogiati/index.php?lang=en    (I am in class 4 - Probable transexual)
 

My own suspicion is that the universe is not only queerer than we suppose, but queerer than we *can* suppose. J.B.S. Haldane

Last Edited By: VeronicaBeta Mar 18 16 5:12 PM. Edited 1 time.

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#16 [url]

Mar 19 16 3:52 AM

Veronica said: "You might want to do this test. maybe help you with your questions. http://transsexual.org/cogiati/index.php?lang=en (I am in class 4 - Probable transexual)"

Oh, i familiar with that test and can say, that for 2 years i shifted from middle of class 3 to middle of class 4.

I see we all have some problems about our crossdressing. It is a lot of moments of happy and sorrow realted to that and a lot of questions same with Francesca. But what i very clear know now. I really want go outside like woman, in completly female style. Cindy talked about some studio, probably it is good opportunity for it. Of course without it i still try increase my make up skills, dress style e.t.c. I think my pass not perfect, but progress for last 2 years is great. And all of that for future going outside (and for comfort of cause too. One week without female look and crossdressing can completly make me too much disphoric)

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#17 [url]

Mar 19 16 6:31 AM

If you girls are taking this test as nothing but fun, then power to you, but just incase someone is taking it as something more I feel the need to put on my skeptic skirt on (has a giant graphic of the Incredible Randi alongside Carl Sagan on it) and relate my experiences with the test.

I tried the COGIATI a couple of years ago (after coming across a reference to it on a fictionmania story) and while I don't remember my exact score I am thinking it was a 70 (or was it -70?) but it classified me as androgyne.  I didn't know why* but I didn't like that result and did some research on it, and from what I gathered back then, the test is not a reliable indicator of anything.  It based on some very dated science and should only be seen as a fun activity to waste time on.




* I think on one level I didn't like the results because I knew something wasn't right and was wanting an exact answer.  Part of me wanting to be in category 4, and another wanting me to be category 2.  

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#18 [url]

Mar 19 16 7:26 AM

Lost, you are quite correct, all of these online tests are more for fun than anything else. They have no basis in diagnosis of anything. They are like the "kissing gauges" that they once had at carnivals.

Like all of us I wish there was a reliable and objective test but there isn't. Determination of transgender and its degree is a matter of introspection, exploration/experimentation, and in many cases, work with a professional to mentor and advise.

I think it's harder to do when one is younger because sexual desire and the erotic nature of it is hard to separate from more fundamental nature. I can speak to that as I'm almost 60! All those years, all those feelings, all that wondering and thinking. I was right about myself all along!

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#19 [url]

Mar 19 16 8:33 AM

Francesca,  Oh I hope you do!  I first joined a TG club when I was 48, and wish I had at 35. ... Another thing you might enjoy is going to a transformation studio. 
For the going out thing, TG club (or if I feel bold enough even maybe regular club? :) ) I think it's just a matter of time. I'd LOVE a transformation studio, what a great idea! But there doesn't seem to be one anywhere close to me. :( In the meanwhile just yesterday I bought my first wig and some cheap makeup, to try to learn what looks best on me... I might eventually get makeup lessons if this and youtube turn out to be not enough. :)
Have you tried pegging? I don't know if your girlfriend is into it, but it might be worth a shot.
I love being pegged, and we do it occasionally. My girlfriend says she enjoys it, but I almost always have to ask for it and when we do it it doesn't feel like she is much involved. It's enjoyable, but for these reasons it doesn't quite take the edge off. Maybe I'm spoiled by my previous experiences with guys. 
I cannot relate. it could possibly be that keeping my "sexuality" and my "gender" identity separated is the only way I have found any clarity. ... I get the idea about just wanting to "surrender" to someone. The question is, are there other aspects of life that you feel the same way about right now? The greatest gratification I get from leaving the house dressed is having nobody even notice me. But at home, I pretty much dress all the time. Even when people come over, like my kids. ... For me, the idea seems not to look "attractive" or even "provocative". ... You might want to do this test.
Well... do you find men attractive? Or do you just feel female? And... are you very sexual? I consciously admitted to myself that I was bisexual relatively early, at about 16 I think, and I already had a feminine side back then, but I never consciously questioned the fact that I should explore that as well, so I never fully expressed it, I'm just getting started. I'm also extremely sexual. This is probably why I'd like to look not provocative, but certainly sexy and attractive if I can, because my inner woman is also a woman for men to look at. 

There is also another aspect to the attractiveness thing. Like many biological women, I am simply insecure to be in public if my looks are less than perfect, even in presence of other women. In privacy I'm ok with my female self being, say, unglamorous, or unkempt. I realize this is just insecurity, but because I am not biologically a woman, the insecurity is multiplied tenfold. I have seen transgender people go out with nothing but a bright wig, female clothing, a 5 o'clock shadow and a confident stride. But this isn't me, at least not for now, probably never.

Just last week my girlfriend's mother came to stay with us, and she'll stay for a while. I had my girlfriend tell her what I am going through (we don't speak the same language, so I can't talk to her myself), and my girlfriend says that her mother didn't even blink at the news. Despite this I am still battling with shame in order to dress up in my own home when she or other guests are around. I hope I'll get there and I'm definitely working for it. And thank you for sharing, that's a beautiful example. 

About the COGIATI test, I already did it some time ago, shortly before I discovered the crossdreamers community, it lists me as androgyne, which I find fitting in some ways but, just like Lost, completely inadequate in others, and then I went to look into its science, and I agree with Lost that the test itself is a fluke, in that it's based on differences between male and female that only affect a minimum percentage of the general population. I also found many questions too vague or not applicable to my situation.

 I don't think there is a psychological test that can tell you who you are. You are yourself, and if you ask yourself enough questions, simply, you know. 
I see we all have some problems about our crossdressing. It is a lot of moments of happy and sorrow realted to that and a lot of questions same with Francesca. But what i very clear know now. I really want go outside like woman, in completly female style. Cindy talked about some studio, probably it is good opportunity for it
Kudos for your realization Eva :) I wish you every success :)

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#20 [url]

Mar 19 16 1:30 PM

I remember doing the COGIATI years ago, I got "bisexual crossdresser" or something like that. I did it again just then and got "androgyne", which is something I identified with at some point a few years ago. Of course, as it's been said already in this thread, the test is little more than a bit of fun.

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